1. #1
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    Default Did you set the parking brake? No. I thought you did...

    http://www.ocala.com/article/2007091...40/1001/NEWS01


    ================================================== ============
    OCALA - What's the difference between the ducks in Lake Tuscawilla and the firetrucks in Ocala Fire Rescue Station One across the street?

    The ducks can swim.
    One of Station One's trucks proved it couldn't Monday afternoon, rolling out of the station, down a ramp and across Northeast Third Street, jumping the curb to plunge cab-first into the lake and join the ducks.

    No one was injured in the 5:45 p.m. accident. Firefighter Dan Pinkston was running by the lake when he saw the unoccupied truck start to roll out.

    "I [saw] the engine starting to creep out," he said. "I went to run up and try to jump in it, then I saw it got up too much speed."

    With a car approaching the station, Pinkston could do nothing more than direct traffic.

    "I just held the car up and watched it happen. There was nothing I could do," he said. "There was so much speed in there . . . it was a lost cause."

    The truck, an E-One Typhoon model 1,000-gallon pumper, rolled into the lake until water nearly covered the driver's compartment. It sat on the bank diagonally, with water almost to the pump control panel on the side. Shortly after it went into the water, the electrical circuit for the warning lights shorted out, turning the lights on, making it appear the truck was on a rescue call.

    Battalion Chief Wendell Rora said the truck was three or four years old, and cost about $250,000 without equipment. Fully equipped as this one was, the truck would cost between $400,000 and $500,000, he said.

    Recovery workers had to drain the truck's water tank before two heavy-duty wreckers were able to pull it out of the lake.

    "When you've got more than 1,000 gallons of water in there, there's over 10,000 pounds right there," Pinkston said.

    By 7 p.m., the wayward truck was back on dry land. A puff of smoke came from the left front wheel well as the tires came out of the water. Soon afterward, the warning lights turned off. Ducks waddled onto the bank for a closer look.

    Beyond a shattered windshield, a badly bent bumper and water pouring out of the opened doors, it was difficult to tell the extent of the damage to the truck. The engine sits behind the cab, so it might not have suffered water damage, Rora said. But the truck did have lots of potentially vulnerable electronic circuitry, he added.

    What caused the truck to roll in the first place remains under investigation, Rora said.

    "If there was any kind of mechanical failure, more than likely it's going to end up at E-One," he said.
    ================================================== =========
    Even the burger-flippers at McDonald's probably have some McWackers.

  2. #2
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    parking brake,always a big deal.
    "sauver ou périr"

    "courage et dévouement"

    2 french mottoes in french fire service.

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    Talking

    That's one way to clean the cab.

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    No hydrant...? No problem!
    United Kingdom branch, IACOJ.

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    Talking Well, I Dunno.....................

    Quote Originally Posted by martinm View Post
    No hydrant...? No problem!
    There IS a difference between "Front Intake" and "Front Endinthelake"
    Never use Force! Get a Bigger Hammer.
    In memory of
    Chief Earle W. Woods, 1912 - 1997
    Asst. Chief John R. Woods Sr. 1937 - 2006

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    Quote Originally Posted by hwoods View Post
    There IS a difference between "Front Intake" and "Front Endinthelake"
    THERE IS??? Dang it Chief, you always said..... heeheheheheeheeehee
    If you don't do it RIGHT today, when will you have time to do it over? (Hall of Fame basketball player/coach John Wooden)

    "I may be slow, but my work is poor." Chief Dave Balding, MVFD

    "Its not Rocket Science. Just use a LITTLE imagination." (Me)

    Get it up. Get it on. Get it done!

    impossible solved cotidie. miracles postulo viginti - quattuor hora animadverto

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    Default Darn someone beat me to start this thread

    So I got the e-mail about this incident the other day....and I must say I like Ocala's proactive approach to a land to lake fire apparatus.

  8. #8
    makes good girls go bad
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    Damn thing looked better as a beer can anyway. E-WONT's are what we have at our station. Guess I will pass this tidbit along.

    E-WONT is based in Ocala, IIRC.
    AJ, MICP, FireMedic
    Member, IACOJ.
    FTM-PTB-EGH-DTRT-RFB-KTF
    This message has been made longer, in part from a grant from the You Are a Freaking Moron Foundation.

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    What a way to turn an e-one into a Seagrave.......

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    Chief- I found the problem....E-One. Parking brake probably broke from normal wear and tear.

    I dont know which is worst- E-One or American LaChance.

  11. #11
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    Whoops, that's tough on the daily report.
    My posts reflect my views and opinions, not the organization I work for or my IAFF local. Some of which they may not agree. I.A.C.O.J. member
    "I ask, Sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people. To disarm the people is the best and most effectual way to enslave them."
    George Mason
    Co-author of the Second Amendment
    during Virginia's Convention to Ratify the Constitution, 1788
    Elevator Rescue Information

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    I thought aluminum cans floated?

    I cant laugh too hard, my FD had the same thing happen about 30 years ago.
    Fire Marshal/Safety Officer

    IAAI-NFPA-IAFC/VCOS-Retired IAFF

    "No his mind is not for rent, to any god or government"
    RUSH-Tom Sawyer

    Success is when skill meets opportunity
    Failure is when fantasy meets reality

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    Quote Originally Posted by hwoods View Post
    There IS a difference between "Front Intake" and "Front Endinthelake"
    I can see the chief talking to the FAO now. Son, you are supposed to put the hard suction on the front intake before trying to draft.

    FAO: Chief I was trying to speed the process up!
    Shawn M. Cecula
    Firefighter
    IACOJ Division of Fire and EMS

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    Once again from the "State Farm ain't never gonna believe this..." files.

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    Default Who done it?

    Who's telling the chief? I'm not telling him, no you tell him, no I did the last time! Hey, this is the first thime for this! I though you chocked the tire, No I though you chocked it!

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    you couldn't bank enough "atta boys" in a 30 year career to cover that "awwww s&!t".

  17. #17
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    my dad had this happen to a spartan. what ended up happening was the valve between the brakes and the resivore (sp) causing the brakes to fill up and release. the engine then decided that the garage next door looked a little more comfortable.
    FOOLS
    RFB-KTF-DTRT

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    Quote Originally Posted by tomlaumann View Post
    Who's telling the chief? I'm not telling him, no you tell him, no I did the last time! Hey, this is the first thime for this! I though you chocked the tire, No I though you chocked it!
    Wheel "chocking" [today] is an anitiquated, unneccessary waste of time on anything built in the last 20 years...since "spring brakes" were invented.

    With no pressure in the system large springs apply enough pressure to the brakes to lock them solid. When getting ready to drive these special air/spring mechanisms are pressurized to make the springs release the mechanical pressure on the brakes. The emergency brake requires a minimum of 60 psi of pressure to release the springs. Thus if there is a large leak, the compressor fails, the regulator fails etc., while you are driving when the air pressure in the tanks reaches 60 psi the spring brakes are going to lock the wheels so you better be safely at the side of the road. An audible "low pressure" warning happens at 80 psi so drivers have a reasonable chance to get the rig to the side of the road.

    http://www.mgmbrakes.com/history.cfm

    "Setting the brakes" by pulling out on the YELLOW BUTTON when the rig is parked is the secret.
    "we learn from history...that we do not learn from history"

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    Default Ya know it's a bad day when . . .

    Human error or mechanical error? Either way it sucks. Feel bad for the "chauffer" though. And just a quick aside to TFMBob . . . anything "man" builds can malfunction. I know of at least three reasons why parking brakes on an air brake system will fail to hold, so I'll keep using the correct chocks thanks. Nothing is "idiotproof", I know because I have invested a large portion of my life proving it. By the way, anybody seen Murphy? If I ever find that S - O - B. . .
    Last edited by Binaroundawhile; 09-22-2007 at 09:10 AM. Reason: why not

  20. #20
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    Question

    Quote Originally Posted by Binaroundawhile View Post
    Human error or mechanical error? Either way it sucks. Feel bad for the "chauffer" though. And just a quick aside to TFMBob . . . anything "man" builds can malfunction. I know of at least three reasons why parking brakes on an air brake system will fail to hold, so I'll keep using the correct chocks thanks. Nothing is "idiotproof", I know because I have invested a large portion of my life proving it.
    I am not questing your three reasons why parking brakes on an air brake system will fail, but I would suggest that you make your "findings" on SPRING BRAKE SYSTEM FAILURES...public to all commerical trucking companys, the Fed. Motor Carriers Assn., and The NFPA...that corrections to the design and operation be addressed ASAP.

    I don't know of a single [commerical] trucking company, that EVER chocks the wheels on a rig...except when backed up to a loading dock, and this is only because some drivers fail to "set the brakes" at docks. I have never seen a fire rig in an apparatus bay with the wheels chocked...except for maybe a 25 year old "reserve" rig without "spring brakes."

    P.S. I just came up with a "brilliant solution" to this. Place cement "speed-bumps" just inside the bay doors of every fire station, so that if and/or when the engineer fails to set the brakes...the rig will only go as far as the overhead door. Now...isn't this a BRILLIANT IDEA..........
    Last edited by TFMBob; 09-22-2007 at 03:34 PM. Reason: additional comment:
    "we learn from history...that we do not learn from history"

  21. #21
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    Talking Heavy Water

    "When you've got more than 1,000 gallons of water in there, there's over 10,000 pounds right there," Pinkston said.
    Must be a lot of iron in that water

  22. #22
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    This reminds me of this ......

    ******=================
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    ------GOD BLESS AMERICA ! ------

  23. #23
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    Default gotta love "experts"

    you might not have "quested" them but here they come genius.

    1 - the spring breaks
    2 - as stated in another post, the air valve fails allowing presure to release the spring
    3 - nobody remembered that the brakes need to be adjusted once in a while. . .

    and the agancies you mention are familiar with them. My POINT was that mechanical stuff can and DOES malfunction. There is a driver in my county that has become intimately familiar with the repercussions of mechanical failures in fire apparatus. He is told he will walk again after a lot of physical therapy. Guess the spring brakes didn't work for him either. BRILLIANT !
    Last edited by Binaroundawhile; 09-23-2007 at 07:49 AM.

  24. #24
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    Red face Not a "genius nor expert"

    Quote Originally Posted by Binaroundawhile View Post
    you might not have "quested" them but here they come genius.

    1 - the spring breaks
    2 - as stated in another post, the air valve fails allowing presure to release the spring
    3 - nobody remembered that the brakes need to be adjusted once in a while. . .

    and the agancies you mention are familiar with them. My POINT was that mechanical stuff can and DOES malfunction. There is a driver in my county that has become intimately familiar with the repercussions of mechanical failures in fire apparatus. He is told he will walk again after a lot of physical therapy. Guess the spring brakes didn't work for him either. BRILLIANT !
    All I stated was...I HAVE NEVER SEEN OR HEARD OF A SPRING BRAKE FAILURE. It is [now] obvious, that I am not near the classification of an "expert" or "genius" as it apparent you are.

    Thank you for enlightning me [and everyone else] on these "facts" that everyone except me...knew about. What a "dope" I am, huh!

    Hear, I have been operating Class-A, Hazardous Material equipment on the public roadways for 40+ years...without a single incident where my SPRING brakes EVER failed. Whow...am I Blessed or what!

    Your "facts" NEED to be passed on to the NFPA, all fire equipment mfgrs. and OSHA, so that new regulations be set forth that it is: MANDATORY that ALL fire apparatus use "wheel chocks," at ALL times when the said vehicle is stationary...to include "when sitting in the fire station"...WITHOUT EXCEPTION. This surely would have helped "the driver in your county" and engineer in Ocala, FL.

    Thanks again for enlightening me.
    "we learn from history...that we do not learn from history"

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by TFMBob View Post
    All I stated was...I HAVE NEVER SEEN OR HEARD OF A SPRING BRAKE FAILURE. It is [now] obvious, that I am not near the classification of an "expert" or "genius" as it apparent you are.

    Thank you for enlightning me [and everyone else] on these "facts" that everyone except me...knew about. What a "dope" I am, huh!

    Hear, I have been operating Class-A, Hazardous Material equipment on the public roadways for 40+ years...without a single incident where my SPRING brakes EVER failed. Whow...am I Blessed or what!

    Your "facts" NEED to be passed on to the NFPA, all fire equipment mfgrs. and OSHA, so that new regulations be set forth that it is: MANDATORY that ALL fire apparatus use "wheel chocks," at ALL times when the said vehicle is stationary...to include "when sitting in the fire station"...WITHOUT EXCEPTION. This surely would have helped "the driver in your county" and engineer in Ocala, FL.

    Thanks again for enlightening me.
    where I stated before that my dad's engine rolled after the valve failed allowing air to leak back into the brakes allwoing them to release. it is now an SOP to chock wheels of the engine or ladder at all times except while parked in the bay.

    my dept doesn't have this SOP but I still do it anyways just because I know what may happen. better safe then sorry.
    FOOLS
    RFB-KTF-DTRT

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