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  1. #1
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    Post Search and Rescue

    I know as an explore everyone does alot of trainning and I have been getting heavily into the SAR and I have picked up some interesting tips and tacticts. I do all my trainig with a 200 lb dummy in full turnout gear and pack to make it as real as possible if the situation of a down firefighter comes up. Some of the tactics I have picked up along the way are:

    -The first tactic is if you have to remove a firefighter from an evirornment and he is dead weigh (unable to help) then you unclip the waist strap and feed it under one of his legs and then reclip it so when you pull an the pack straps it doesn't just pull right up.
    -Next I just learned this last night you do what is called a handcuff knot where you put it knot over the persons wrists or ankels and can be used to pull the firefighter out. (If you don't know this knot it it is really easy to learn and usful in situations like this)
    - I don't know if anyone carries webbing but if you take the webbing put the persaons feet through the big loop then you pull it up th their pits and it provides a good surface to pull. (this works good if you have two rescuers because it will work much faster)
    -If you don't have a hose to follow in you can us a search line and instead of carrying it you can clip it to your pack and if the rope bag is done right it should just come out without getting snaged and once you located your victim you just pull the rope tight and it will give you the quickest way out
    - A way to increase your search spand is to always have one person with their hand on the rope or hose and that person have an axe and then have another person on the end of that axe so your search spand goes from 6ft to about 15ft to 20ft

    So if anyone has anymore tips, tactic, or experiances that they have had and that they would like to share than that would be great because if not now than eventually we will all find ourselves in a situation where we might have to impliment these skills (even though I hope no one will have to) and there would be nothing better than to be the best there is when it comes to stuff like SAR or RIT (at least I think so)

    Thanks

    Stay Safe


  2. #2
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    great advice! its great that you are learning from others and spreading the things you are learning. someday you might have to use this on someone and if you have to you will be ready. don't forget to train on situations that prevent the need for firefighter rescue, and to train on calling a mayday and what to do if you need to be rescued. stay safe!

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    Smile

    Thanks alot man

  4. #4
    Forum Member Bones42's Avatar
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    If you don't have a hose to follow in you can us a search line and instead of carrying it you can clip it to your pack and if the rope bag is done right it should just come out without getting snaged and once you located your victim you just pull the rope tight and it will give you the quickest way out
    While this works, it's better if you clip the rope at the entrance and carry the rope bag with you. That way, you don't have to worry about it getting snagged. Also, when it's time to leave, you can pull the rope tight to follow it out. Following a loose rope can be a real challenge.

    And the first thing you want to do for that downed FF is get them air. RIT Pak, spare SCBA, whatever.


    Keep learning.
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

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    You also need to learn that you dont need to be in physical contact with your search partner. As long as you can hear and/or see him you can sperate yourself from him in order to cover more area. Just remember to keep someone on the wall and stick to your decisions(i.e. go right stay right)

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    Forum Member ndvfdff33's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by swfire42 View Post
    You also need to learn that you dont need to be in physical contact with your search partner. As long as you can hear and/or see him you can sperate yourself from him in order to cover more area. Just remember to keep someone on the wall and stick to your decisions(i.e. go right stay right)
    You really think in a smoke filled room or house you are going to be able to see him??? Not likely. So what if he gets hurt or lost. Now you have the original victims on top of your partner now. Sorry but I don't beleive in seperating just to cover more area.
    If someone with multiple personalities threatens to kill himself, is it considered a hostage situation?

    Ryan

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    Quote Originally Posted by ndvfdff33 View Post
    You really think in a smoke filled room or house you are going to be able to see him??? Not likely. So what if he gets hurt or lost. Now you have the original victims on top of your partner now. Sorry but I don't beleive in seperating just to cover more area.
    I understand that you will not likely be able to see your partner. The seperation works very well and it is all about your comfort level. If you don't feel comfortable getting away from your partner don't but this is the way we train and operate. You can clear a floor in almost half the time. This also works well for small rooms, you leave your partner at the door and go in clear the room and you are done and can move on. This tactic is widely used in New England and was even the way we were trained at my academy.

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    Why don't you just go in alone? You have a radio.

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    Forum Member ndvfdff33's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by swfire42 View Post
    I understand that you will not likely be able to see your partner. The seperation works very well and it is all about your comfort level. If you don't feel comfortable getting away from your partner don't but this is the way we train and operate. You can clear a floor in almost half the time. This also works well for small rooms, you leave your partner at the door and go in clear the room and you are done and can move on. This tactic is widely used in New England and was even the way we were trained at my academy.
    I see where your coming from. At the time I was like seperate?? WTF. Now I see the light though. If it works for you then have at er. Different strokes for different folks I guess. What works in New England might now where I am. As long as everyone comes home safe thats the main thing.
    If someone with multiple personalities threatens to kill himself, is it considered a hostage situation?

    Ryan

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    Quote Originally Posted by ndvfdff33 View Post
    I see where your coming from. At the time I was like seperate?? WTF. Now I see the light though. If it works for you then have at er. Different strokes for different folks I guess. What works in New England might now where I am. As long as everyone comes home safe thats the main thing.
    Absolutely. Safety is numero uno. Everyone goes home!!

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    Forum Member ndvfdff33's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by swfire42 View Post
    Absolutely. Safety is numero uno. Everyone goes home!!
    Amen to that one.
    If someone with multiple personalities threatens to kill himself, is it considered a hostage situation?

    Ryan

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    Me either.If you lose contact with your partner and the wall,what are you going to do?You might crawl right over a weak spot in the floor and go through it.Then you gotta explain to the LT what you were doing damaging FD equipment.
    Stay in physical contact with your buddy,one of you stays in physical contact with the wall,both of you sweep the area in front of you to make sure it's safe to crawl over and use an axe handle or halligan to sweep towards the center of the room to find victims.Always tell your partner what you are doing,don't suddenly break contact with him/her when you find something that needs investigating.All they'll know is that you let go and didn't say why.Let them know if you are letting go and why before doing so.Don't worry about the scene from "Backdraft"where they pranked the newbie with a mannequin.SAR is too serious for that worry.
    Always mark any entrance to a room that you are searching.If you don't come out and don't answer the radio(or don't have one)when searchers do come after you,they'll have a starting point.
    I'd carry wooden chocks with my helmet number on them for that purpose.I'd cut them myself from scrap wood instead of buying them so I wouldn't get emotionally attached to them and just HAVE to recover them during take up instead of rolling hose and rehabbing my SCBA.

    Quote Originally Posted by ndvfdff33 View Post
    You really think in a smoke filled room or house you are going to be able to see him??? Not likely. So what if he gets hurt or lost. Now you have the original victims on top of your partner now. Sorry but I don't beleive in seperating just to cover more area.

  13. #13
    Forum Member Bones42's Avatar
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    You really think in a smoke filled room or house you are going to be able to see him???
    Try voice contact.

    Never lost touch with your partner? What happens, should you come across a couch. Do you only search what you can reach, while keeping touch with your partner? or do you search the entire couch and all around it?
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

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    If anyone is interested in getting some T.I.C (thermal imiging camera) practice in you can take your dummy waits until it gets dark or if you have a smoke machine avalible to your department (make sure your got permission) and go into your bay and put a couple of hot packs in the dummy's pocket and this can serve as some trainning with the T.I.C if you are unfamiliar with it. I know this isn't exactly like the real thing but it is a good trainning experiance if anyone is board and you want somethink to do

    Stay Safe

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    Quote Originally Posted by btvaine View Post
    If anyone is interested in getting some T.I.C (thermal imiging camera) practice in you can take your dummy waits until it gets dark or if you have a smoke machine avalible to your department (make sure your got permission) and go into your bay and put a couple of hot packs in the dummy's pocket and this can serve as some trainning with the T.I.C if you are unfamiliar with it. I know this isn't exactly like the real thing but it is a good trainning experiance if anyone is board and you want somethink to do

    Stay Safe
    You could also have one person hide in a dark room and have to find him with the camera. That way you get to see what body heat really looks like.

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    Thats probably a little more relistic heat signature than just a couple of heat packs I also heard of people putting mirrors in a room too to make more challenging because you are not only seeing the victims heat signature but you own but reflected

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    Forum Member Bones42's Avatar
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    Just remember, in a fire situation, where there is lots of heat...the victim may very well be the coolest thing in the room and would therefore show up as a dark object. Nothing beats training with the TIC in a live fire evolution.
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

  18. #18
    Forum Member ndvfdff33's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bones42 View Post
    Try voice contact.

    Never lost touch with your partner? What happens, should you come across a couch. Do you only search what you can reach, while keeping touch with your partner? or do you search the entire couch and all around it?
    I know voice contact, I'm just saying that if you are seperated in a larger room what happens if your partner gets injured and cannot talk to you. Thats all I was trying to say. Then you have to place your focus on finding him/her, removing them from the building delaying your search and rescue operation. Like I said in my second post if it works for him fill your boots, but I personally would not do it.
    If someone with multiple personalities threatens to kill himself, is it considered a hostage situation?

    Ryan

  19. #19
    Forum Member Frmboybuck's Avatar
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    I also dont like the idea of loosing contact with my partner. I prefer to use my webbing for S&R. You can cover alot of area in a hurry and you maintain contact with your partner.
    Buck
    Assistant Chief/EMT-B

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