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  1. #1
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    Lightbulb Stabilizer/Aerial interlock dependability & configurations.

    As you know when stabilizer/aerial interlocks malfunction, it may create a situation that prevents raising the aerial or rotating the aerial device; even though the stabilizers are properly and fully deployed. This can effectively “kill” aerial operations before they even begin at a real scene. At the very least this can cause SERIOUS confusion and possible life loss at a rescue scene due to delays resulting from a "false" inoperable condition. It can also cause the need for potentially dangerous overrides (in the wrong hands) to be actuated.

    Let’s face it – most people are not fully qualified to actuate overrides that have the potential to tip a truck over by allowing rotation over short jacks, or raising the aerial in the first place when jacks (stabilizers) are deemed not fully deployed. In fact the majority don’t even know where these overrides are some times and if they do, they don’t know just how serious they are.

    SO! What has been all of your experiences with stabilizer interlocks out there? I am asking because through your information, personal experiences and responses about the various trucks you own, others can glean from it which ones are working and which ones malfunction. It can let others know who may be “looking”, which systems are easily damaged, which ones are dependable, which ones just don’t work well, etc.

    If you post tell us what year the truck is so others can judge how time affects the various designs. (any other info such as the environment the truck is run in, etc can also be helpful). TL


  2. #2
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    Default

    Wow, it appears all those people who have complained to me over the years about this “across the board” problem we see in just about every device, were in error.

    I guess I should have poured some kool-aid on this thread to make it more interesting and “gossipistic”, instead of bringing up a subject worthy of being discussed on its own merrits .

    My bust. TL

  3. #3
    MembersZone Subscriber mcaldwell's Avatar
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    Well I'll play, if just to keep the thread bumped for ya.

    Our wee little 65 Telesqurt still has the new truck smell, so I haven't seen an interlock malfunction "yet". We do get some hydraulic settling from time to time that causes it to lock out unexpectedly. This is always due to an operator halting his jacks the second he gets a green light.

    It is mostly a training issue to ensure the operators know to raise the stabilizers well past the activation of the green light to allow room for the outriggers to settle an inch or so if necessary. Also, new operators don't always recognize the problem immediately, and that tends to cause some confusion and uneccessary delay.

    I hope we don't ever see an actual failure, as we don't train for "short-jacked" operation (at least at this point in time). The senior guys know how to operate the overides to stow the stick, but not for the intent of effecting rescue.
    Never argue with an Idiot. They drag you down to their level, and then beat you with experience!

    IACOJ

  4. #4
    Forum Member DeputyChiefGonzo's Avatar
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    We have two E-One 110' aerials (a 1982 and a 2000), both rear mount. As far I know, there hasn't been an issue with the stabilizer/interlock and override switches. The older one (Ladder 1) has to be "finessed" a little more, as she's a cranky old girl that's due to be replaced.

    As MCaldwell stated, most interlock problems are operator error that needs to be overcome with training.
    ‎"The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
    Lt. Ray McCormack, FDNY

  5. #5
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    Default Hp-75

    My dept has a 2001 E-One HP-75 and no problems so far with the interlocks. We did have problems with the paint peeling and cracking and one of computer boards. The truck had to be sanded down and repainted twice before the paint took. The computer board was taken care of in a slow manner but it was taken care of.

  6. #6
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    We've got a couple of 2000 HME/Central States 75' quints, one of which had this issue. It was a quick fix on the sensor.

    We had the other one do it one day while we were trying to do some maintenance. In the process of trying to figure things out (and the deputy chief was present at the time), it magically started working again. I don't konw if they found any shorts or anything after that or not.

    We do use them pretty frequently, but as you know, it happens when you need it.

  7. #7
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    Default I'll Bite

    Quote Originally Posted by SSIaerialmanTIM View Post
    As you know when stabilizer/aerial interlocks malfunction, it may create a situation that prevents raising the aerial or rotating the aerial device; even though the stabilizers are properly and fully deployed. This can effectively “kill” aerial operations before they even begin at a real scene. At the very least this can cause SERIOUS confusion and possible life loss at a rescue scene due to delays resulting from a "false" inoperable condition. It can also cause the need for potentially dangerous overrides (in the wrong hands) to be actuated.

    Let’s face it – most people are not fully qualified to actuate overrides that have the potential to tip a truck over by allowing rotation over short jacks, or raising the aerial in the first place when jacks (stabilizers) are deemed not fully deployed. In fact the majority don’t even know where these overrides are some times and if they do, they don’t know just how serious they are.

    SO! What has been all of your experiences with stabilizer interlocks out there? I am asking because through your information, personal experiences and responses about the various trucks you own, others can glean from it which ones are working and which ones malfunction. It can let others know who may be “looking”, which systems are easily damaged, which ones are dependable, which ones just don’t work well, etc.

    If you post tell us what year the truck is so others can judge how time affects the various designs. (any other info such as the environment the truck is run in, etc can also be helpful). TL
    Tim,

    As you well know most manufacturers have come a long way from the overrides of yesterday vs those of today.

    Most interlock problems as stated: "As MCaldwell stated, most interlock problems are operator error that needs to be overcome with training." I have not seem many problems with the interlocks themselfs.

    As with most equipment today if you are not properly trained in there use you risk doing something that can cause problems.

    With todays overrides if something happens to the truck, it is because somebody did something they should not have been doing!!!!!! As with most things in the fire service today we do not take the time to PROPERLY TRAIN our operators.

    Chief1FF

  8. #8
    Forum Member IronsMan53's Avatar
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    Default

    We've had problems with the microsensor arms on top of the hydraulic cylinders of our H-type outriggers being bent out of shape over a period of time. They will then not register the load because the arm would not be in contact with the cylinder. This would in turn cause a lock out.

    We have 3 104' towers and 2 75' Quints with this set up. All Spartan/Ferrara/RK Aerials
    I can't believe they actually pay me to do this!!!

    One friend noted yesterday that a fire officer only carries a flashlight, sometimes prompting grumbling from firefighters who have to lug tools and hoses.
    "The old saying is you never know how heavy that flashlight can become," the friend said.
    -from a tragic story posted on firefighterclosecalls.com

  9. #9
    Forum Member Rescue101's Avatar
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    Interlocks? Overrides? Can't comment on these,they are non existant on our present stick.Oh,we'll have to get used to it,the new one will have a rash of 'em.The old ALF has an either/or,you either jack(2)or ladder.And it either works,or doesn't depending on the seriousness of the incident.Like Gonzo says,a little "finesse"(insert your favorite adjective/adjustment here) and it will play.T.C.
    .

  10. #10
    Forum Member Bones42's Avatar
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    When we have an interlock failure, I'll be sure to post it here for discussion.
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rescue101 View Post
    Interlocks? Overrides? Can't comment on these,they are non existant on our present stick.Oh,we'll have to get used to it,the new one will have a rash of 'em.The old ALF has an either/or,you either jack(2)or ladder.And it either works,or doesn't depending on the seriousness of the incident.Like Gonzo says,a little "finesse"(insert your favorite adjective/adjustment here) and it will play.T.C.
    .
    101 have you gone to bid yet? The last post I read on here somewhere you still had not gone to bid. What are you getting?

  12. #12
    Forum Member Rescue101's Avatar
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    47,RFP's ARE out.The ? remains.Seven players,4 to 5 are hungry and eager to play,two are ho hum and I'm not particularly enthused about their product anyway.Four of the top contenders have sales staff that have become or already were very dear friends to me so the decisions won't be easy. And the "friend"part of it isn't a deciding factor it's based on who,in our opinion,will build the best piece to serve the long term needs of the community. Still,thru this medium,I've made a great number of contacts and people who have helped us in the process. A special thanks to Glenn Davis and Tom Woodard of Lakes Region Fire Apparatus who have spent a lot of time helping on this project,.I've learned a great deal from all of you on items I would probably not thought about if I hadn't "poked"a stick in here and there. I thank you all for the information and the good times our "sparring" has produced.Bids are to be opened Nov 3rd if I remember right,I'll let you know shortly after. T.C.

  13. #13
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    Default American LaFance Eagle

    We have had interlock problems with our 2002 American LaFrance/LTI 75' rear mount. The problem seems to be with the 'outrigger down' indicator on the officer's side outrigger (it’s a single rear axle with only 2 outriggers).

    The problem had been addressed by our Support Division, but the issue still persisted (amongst others). However, a permanent solution was just developed... they gave us a brand-new 2007 Rosenbauer/General/RK/Spartan 75' rear mount last week. It's amazing what a little complaining will get ya.


    The Rosenbauer has an Aerial/Outrigger Over-ride switch located on the rear of the rig- noticeably labeled and in easy access for anyone walking by. At least the LaFrance kept their switches buried behind the outrigger.


    On a side note- is it common practice for the dead-man switch on the turntable to be by-passed when the over-ride is activated?

    Iluv4201

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iluv4201 View Post
    We have had interlock problems with our 2002 American LaFrance/LTI 75' rear mount. The problem seems to be with the 'outrigger down' indicator on the officer's side outrigger (it’s a single rear axle with only 2 outriggers).

    The problem had been addressed by our Support Division, but the issue still persisted (amongst others). However, a permanent solution was just developed... they gave us a brand-new 2007 Rosenbauer/General/RK/Spartan 75' rear mount last week. It's amazing what a little complaining will get ya.


    The Rosenbauer has an Aerial/Outrigger Over-ride switch located on the rear of the rig- noticeably labeled and in easy access for anyone walking by. At least the LaFrance kept their switches buried behind the outrigger.


    On a side note- is it common practice for the dead-man switch on the turntable to be by-passed when the over-ride is activated?
    Iluv4201
    Iluv,

    It is on ALF products. The Dead man switch opens the blocking selonoid.

    Chief1ff

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