Disturbing

[CaptBob]

If this is you, don't bother filling out the application:

http://www.cbsnews.com/sections/i_vi...ml?id=3486473n

Captain Bob

www.eatstress.com

[ffbam24]

That.....explains....A LOT!

They are already infiltrating the fire service.
I found a large disregard towards those of us that have served in the military on top of this.

[RspctFrmCalgary]

Interesting piece.

[KenNFD1219]

We had quite a few people with that attitude during our application period last spring. One guy took the application, whipped out a pen and put the application against the wall and started to fill it out. A few asked for a pen and access to the photocopier. Several had mom or dad pick up the application and try to "put in a good word" for junior. One guy wanted to know how the recruit academy would affect his other job. A whole bunch came in looking like they just rolled out of bed. This type of attitude has always been around, but it seems now it is more pervasive.

Fortunately, most of the applicants came in prepared, squared away, and with an attitude that showed they are ready to go to work.

[JayDudley]

Makes me glad to be a BOOMER and retired. I'd be pulling my hair out.

[JLam77]

Fortunately, most of the applicants came in prepared, squared away, and with an attitude that showed they are ready to go to work.

There's the main thing...most of them had a good attitude.

Look, that piece in the OP is typical of what any generation says about the generation or two that follow. They're just a buncha no-good lazy bums, right? I mean, that's what the Depression Generation said about the boomers. Just a buncha long haired pot smokin hippies, right? Now those long-haired pot smoking hippies are the ones who are now retiring and complaining about the next crop of whippersnappers.

Every generation has losers. Focusing on them and then trying to paint an entire generation with that broad brush is not being intellectually honest.

[JTFIRE80]

Watching that sure makes me glad my parents did thier job the right way.

Now, if we can only get all parents to educate thier children with a little common sense and ethics, well, that would be something to see!!

[KenNFD1219]

Look, that piece in the OP is typical of what any generation says about the generation or two that follow.

"The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for
authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place
of exercise. Children are now tyrants, not the servants of their
households. They no longer rise when elders enter the room. They
contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up dainties
at the table, cross their legs, and tyrannize their teachers."

Atributed to Socrates by Plato

[SeminoleB]

As a "millennial," I'd like to chime in. While I definitely wouldn't say that this piece is wrong and it has some very good, true, points, it also misses a few key points.

First off, the boomer bosses are, very likely, the ones to blame. Who are the parents of these kids? They are. They likely have a little Johnny and/or Susie out there that falls in this category.

Secondly, the job market has CHANGED. (Obviously, the fire service is different and exempt from much of my argument.) Gone are the days when you can easily go work for a company at 20 and retire from them 30+ years later with a good pension and good benefits. The only places that really offer this are government entities nowadays.

The workers of the boomer generation had this luxury. The generations that followed got laid the hell off. You can't really specialize in anything anymore and have job security. Look at all of the people in the auto and steel industries. They got screwed because they believed they would be secure in a job and they did not learn extra skills. When the layoffs came, they weren't prepared to move to another job market.

So, now, slaving away at a job and being a "good employee" doesn't guarantee anything. Plus, employees entering the workforce now have to remain versatile. Many times this comes from working in many different job situations and having a diversity in training.

While I definitely don't agree my generation should feel "entitled" to anything, I do think that striving for a goal and a job you love is paramount. In my case, that job is the fire service. I have a degree and I had a chance to go work more than one office job with a starting pay of 60k plus. But, I wouldn't be happy doing that. I want to be a firefighter, plain and simple. I love the job, I love the satisfaction it gives, and I love the REWARD and ACCOMPLISHMENT of putting out a fire, helping someone out of an emergency situation, making a difference in someone's life.

Guess I am of the Millennial Generation.

[SPFDRum]

Unfortunately, it explains alot...

[mpullen32]

I to am one of these "millennials" and can agree and disagree with the show. There are several valid points that the presenter makes along with several that seem to be misunderstood. Ever generation argues that the following generations have something wrong with them. Whether they are drug consuming hippies or kids who want everything done for them, there is always something. The older generation feels as though they do everything the right way and the younger generation does not. If anyone is to blame, I feel it is the parents, the baby-boomers. Parents are the ones handing over anything the child wants. Therefore, they are the problem not the child. This seems to be the most misunderstood point. The same people who are arguing the problem are the ones creating it. My .02 cents

[JLam77]

The same people who are arguing the problem are the ones creating it.

Hit the nail on the head right there.

[SeminoleB]

It is also just a part of being YOUNG. Many hard working, older adults I know have all sorts of stories about screwing off in their early-mid 20s. Once most people get to late-20s and early-30s, they have calmed down and seated into the "normal" workforce. While I think that some of the traits mentioned will continue on, most will not.

The positive reinforcement and constant challenging of employees does help with productivity. Leisure time at work is one of those things that is paid for by the fact that work no longer stops when you step out of the office. Laptops, video meetings, and Blackberries are just a few things that have killed many workers' ability to detach from work and have free time.

Also, many other societies don't run people into the ground with work so much. In European countries, people get much more vacation (holiday) time than we Americans do. We're pretty lucky as firefighters, as trades, longer vacation times, and schedules allow us to have more time off (or, work more concentrated hours) that we don't feel it as much.

Honestly, I find it a little strange that a group of firefighters are getting upset about this. Don't WE get some leisure time on the job as long as we do our job properly? Doesn't this sometimes seem to be an erroneous view the general public has; that we get paid good money (their tax dollars) sit around watching TV all day and sleeping? Isn't it, in most cases, far from the truth?

At least that's what my mommy said in a phone call to my boss explaining my acting out and need for nap time at work...

[hcfdpalmer9]

Like some other people said that video had some good points. But all of us 18-25 year olds can't be lumped into one group of lazy, think everything has to be handed to us crybabies. I am 18 and I work two jobs and go to school so I can live on my own and be independent. I have worked a job since I was 16 and graduated high school with a B+ average. My parents never handed me anything, I worked to pay for my first truck, every insurance payment, gas in the truck and anything else I wanted. I understand the valid points of the video in that most of the people my age have had everything handed to them. I disagree with the whole 18-25 year old group being portrayed this way.

[PyroPat]

As a "millennial," I'd like to chime in. While I definitely wouldn't say that this piece is wrong and it has some very good, true, points, it also misses a few key points.

First off, the boomer bosses are, very likely, the ones to blame. Who are the parents of these kids? They are. They likely have a little Johnny and/or Susie out there that falls in this category.

Secondly, the job market has CHANGED. (Obviously, the fire service is different and exempt from much of my argument.) Gone are the days when you can easily go work for a company at 20 and retire from them 30+ years later with a good pension and good benefits. The only places that really offer this are government entities nowadays.

The workers of the boomer generation had this luxury. The generations that followed got laid the hell off. You can't really specialize in anything anymore and have job security. Look at all of the people in the auto and steel industries. They got screwed because they believed they would be secure in a job and they did not learn extra skills. When the layoffs came, they weren't prepared to move to another job market.

So, now, slaving away at a job and being a "good employee" doesn't guarantee anything. Plus, employees entering the workforce now have to remain versatile. Many times this comes from working in many different job situations and having a diversity in training.

While I definitely don't agree my generation should feel "entitled" to anything, I do think that striving for a goal and a job you love is paramount. In my case, that job is the fire service. I have a degree and I had a chance to go work more than one office job with a starting pay of 60k plus. But, I wouldn't be happy doing that. I want to be a firefighter, plain and simple. I love the job, I love the satisfaction it gives, and I love the REWARD and ACCOMPLISHMENT of putting out a fire, helping someone out of an emergency situation, making a difference in someone's life.

Guess I am of the Millennial Generation.

Couldn't have said it much better myself, I feel pretty much the same way...


well, I as a "millenial" have to chime in as well....

As a young, successful firefighter/paramedic at the ripe old age of 20 years old, living a great life, being able to retire by 45, and have a GREAT salary and benefits package, I guess yea, I can disagree alittle....I may not have the life expierence of some, but I think by now I know the meaning of hardwork, and sacrifice. This is of course, the fire service though, this job aint changed that much! I think all of us "millenials" ( damn that sounds stupid) in the fire service need to remember that. We AREN'T "the norm" of todays youth. Just look around. Look around at all your friends who aren't in the fire service, and what they are doing with there lives. So many of my friends are in college, yes, but how many of them really know the meaning of hardwork and dedication and direction in life when mommy and daddy are throwing everything at them? I live in central florida, in the booming area of the university of central florida, and it is ever so apparent were some of these kids heads are at. I do not feel entitled to anything, or feel "holier than thou" per say, but I feel I am miles ahead of some people my age and older in life and maturity because of the path I've chosen. The fire service isn't for everyone, and isn't everything in life ( well, to us it is, right?) but looking around at my friends and what they are doing, I'm damn glad I'm in a job with the stability, benefits, and character building attributes that the fire service offers.


While I agree this episode of 60 minutes has its points, it doesn't paint the whole picture. Jobs today do not have the benefits and the "security" of jobs of yesterday, as SeminoleB above my pointed out.

[hcfdpalmer9]

As Pyro Pat said I guess I am in the minority too. I feel that I am way more responsible and mature than almost all of my friends my age. I was just saying that everyone that is a "millenial" can't be grouped into that one little mindset.

[DennisTheMenace]

Nothing new here. We have a 49 year old Capt, second generation in the department, whos mom is still his greatest advocate with the department, who helps keep the station home like and feeds the crew atleast once a month. She knows as much or more about the department as half the Batallion Chiefs and so does her son. A parent advocate is not a terrable thing, it is nothing new, and I actually like knowing that my co-workers come from caring families that provide everyone with additional support. Not too many jobs where co-workers families can intermingle as much as the fire departments, and if that means parents are involved too, so what. If a parent is sweating the bs admin crap for their kid so that he/she can concentraite on the job itself so much the better. It does not always show a lack of maturity, rather it sometimes shows a different set of priority areas in ones life.

[Alucard]

If this is you, don't bother filling out the application:

http://www.cbsnews.com/sections/i_vi...ml?id=3486473n

Captain Bob

www.eatstress.com

Yes, Capt. Bob, I agree. There are those folks who arent cut out for the Fire Service. It is a PARAMILITARY organization, and doesnt cater to the individual, nor does it offer favoritism, and TEAMWORK is emphasized, as is selflessness.

On the other hand, dont refuse to hire me because of my tatts, or you have a legal fight on your hands. I find it humorous that the Marines and other branches of the service are starting to turn their noses up at tatts, and I remember my Grandfather, a decorated Veteran of the Siege of Berlin, crossed the Siegfried Line and the "Dragon's Teeth" to help liberate Europe from Hitler had tatts all over both arms and his chest, which were all about his pride in serving the United States Army. These days, some moron recruiter with no combat experience would tell him he couldnt join up because of the new Milquetoast Standards. I hope that Fire Service does not become that ignorant.

[CaptBob]

As had been mentioned above a lot of candidates are serious about their pursuit of a badge. Many aren't. Here’s some recent encounters:

When you turn in an application for a fire job the clock starts ticking. Sometimes the clock goes slow. Sometimes it speeds up. What we find with too many candidates is they let time get away from them and they’re caught flat footed for the next step in the hiring process. Usually it’s when they get the letter that their oral board is in a few days. Ouch.

A candidate called me this week that had applied for a job last May. Now in short order everything was put on the front burner. The oral board, background, medical and psych. He panicked to get up to speed to be prepared for these critical important steps in the hiring process. The clock had been ticking since May. What was he doing to be prepared? As our son Captain Rob says, “You knew when you turned in the application there was an oral in your future. You just didn’t know when.” Now, it’s an emergency.

When I returned a call to another candidate this week he told me his oral board was the next day and could I help him with his answer? What? That wasn’t going to happen in the eleventh hour but I told him I would listen to a couple of his answers. The phone went silent. I could hear tumble weeds in the background. He finally said he just couldn’t think of anything right then. If he couldn’t think of anything right then, how was he going to show up the next day for his oral board interview?

What time is it?

An hour later this same candidates wife calls and wants to go over some of his answers. What? Sorry we only talk to the candidate. By the way is your husband practicing with a hand held recorder that goes everywhere his car keys go. Silence. Then, well, I know he’s practicing some. Have you ever heard his answers? Now I wish I had a dollar for every time I’ve heard this reply. She said no. He won’t let me listen to his answers. Yea, I heard this all the time. What’s up with this? Here’s the love of his life that has been on the sidelines cheering their guys on and they won’t tell them their answers.

Then the bride goes on with he’s such a great guy and if only the panel could know that. Oh, boy, hear that all the time too. Sorry, you have to convince the oral board that he is.

Had another candidate who had all kinds of education, experience, a volunteer but couldn’t seem to get hired. He wouldn’t share his answers with his wife either. What are these guys in the witness protection program or what? So, his wife went with him on a mini vacation where he was going to take an oral board. Turns out she’s sitting in the hallway outside the room where the orals were being conducted and could hear her husbands answers for the first time. When she called me she said he stunk. Bad. So, she gives him a coaching session for his birthday. She was right. He stunk. Bad. No mystery why he wasn’t getting hired.

Got another call from a candidate where the last step of the hiring process was his medical in a couple of days. Are you concerned about anything? Not really. But I do have elevated blood pressure. It runs in the family. What? Like, how elevated? Well, 135 over 96. That’s high enough to be medicated. Yea, my doctor has told me this. But I didn’t want to get medicated and have to put it down on my medical form.

Tic Toc

Had several e-mails and finally a call from another parent who’s son had taken the written portion of a psych test, found our psych information on this web site and wanted to go over his sons answers and damage control before the interview with the doc. What? How come your son isn’t calling? He’s been too busy. We only talk to the candidates.

I was at a written test for a large department. How many parents showed up with their little precious children candidates surprised me. Yea, they walked though the line and then big hugs good-bye at the door. What? When are you going to cut the cord?

The clock is ticking.

[hookandcanman83]

i would like to give my 2 cents. i think this is an interesting piece. however i think there is one problem. i think the people that were interviewed for this are drastically different then anyone that has posted on this thread. i am a "millennial" and those two guys are about the same age as i am. just a little background on me i am a career EMT and trying to become a career firefighter. i spent most of my life from base to base because my father AND mother were both in the Marine Corps. i think that piece was only concentrated on office workers and sit behind a desk type people. i am not that type of person. Capt. Bob was right when he said dont bother filling out the application. people like that will not last. however i think that the job does not attract people like that. i can only image what my capt. would say to me if i asked him for a letter to send home to my mother or grandmother. also the things like nap rooms and bouncing balls instead of chairs will never be seen in a firehouse. i think the fire service as a whole does not have to worry too much about those type of people. there is too much tradition and professionalism to see any of that crap. just my opinion though.