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  1. #21
    Truckie SPFDRum's Avatar
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    I don't know what the answer is-have we been that fortunate or is our training a little better that we haven't suffered a lodd apparatus operation related....(here in Minnesota, career or vollie) Probably a bit of both.
    I can understand what you are getting at.
    My posts reflect my views and opinions, not the organization I work for or my IAFF local. Some of which they may not agree. I.A.C.O.J. member
    "I ask, Sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people. To disarm the people is the best and most effectual way to enslave them."
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    Co-author of the Second Amendment
    during Virginia's Convention to Ratify the Constitution, 1788
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  2. #22
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    I wouldn't think a Haz-Mat endorsment would be needed just for the amount of fuel needed to run your tools. Most of the Items that would require it would be in large quanities. For bulk liquids, a placard isn't required until 1,000 gallons, while for other stuff, it's usually anything over 1,000 Lbs. There are some OTR trucks that carry around 600 gallons of fuel, and the driver is not required to have his HM endorsment.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by GhostRider73 View Post
    I wouldn't think a Haz-Mat endorsment would be needed just for the amount of fuel needed to run your tools. Most of the Items that would require it would be in large quanities. For bulk liquids, a placard isn't required until 1,000 gallons, while for other stuff, it's usually anything over 1,000 Lbs. There are some OTR trucks that carry around 600 gallons of fuel, and the driver is not required to have his HM endorsment.
    A HazMat endorsement is required only when the vehicle is "...required to be placarded." In general, placards are required for most HazMats in non-bulk packaging when there's over 1,000 lbs. aggregate on board. Certain items that we refer to as "Table 1" HazMats require placards for any quantity. Bulk packaging almost always require placards. For liquids, a bulk package is any container that holds 118.9 gallons (450 liters). The regs on the subject take up over 30 pages. There are many exceptions. Fuel in the vehicle's fuel tank is always excepted from shipping papers, marking, labeling and placarding.

    Stay safe out there, everyone goes home!

  4. #24
    Forum Member Frmboybuck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SPFDRum View Post
    It's more than just going out to get a CDL. iIn Minnesota, you would also need a health card, tanker endorsement, air brake endorsement, and depending on how much fuel you have onboard for power tools, maybe even a haz-mat endorsement.
    So is having a CDL the answer or is having dedicated apparatus training tailored for your department more feasible?
    The tanker, air brake, and haz-mat(would never be needed but it cant hurt) are all part of the CDL. You can take all endorsements in one sitting at the DMV. As for the medical card. ALL members of any dept should have one. It just shows one is in good health. Your typical physical card. CDL should be required before you can take the EVOC training
    Buck
    Assistant Chief/EMT-B

  5. #25
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    Thumbs up CDL's

    Sorry, I'm not picking on Vollies, bless them, we wouldn't have the bulk of the North American Fire Service without them.

    But useing as an example where a young (high testosterone quotent) FF, maybe without the most detailed training, who probably drives the rig much less frequently than a paid department member, can jump in a high powered, heavy, high CG apparatus and go balls to the wall Code 3. I don't like those odds. I think the rigors of getting a CDL (I have one) would help display the seriousness of the members attitude about safety and probably help temper the "get there at any cost" attitude I see in a lot of our colleges.

  6. #26
    Forum Member HSFDChief600's Avatar
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    Ok ill throw my 2 cents in. I have been a CDL driver for 21 years and I can tell you that a CDL is not the cure all. It is training and experiance that will make the difference. Anyone thats good at taking tests can get a CDL and just a little skill will get the driving down. If you are driving a rig thats got enough fuel for a Haz-Mat endorsement you got in the wrong rig at the station.
    I have been run off the road by CDL drivers and the old fella driving the big RV (Dont get me started on the RV's ) Any firefighter gets jacked up when we go to a call ...its what you do with it that will make the difference on how you drive and arrive.
    Forrest Gregg
    Chief
    Holtville/Slapout
    Fire & Rescue Inc.
    District 10 Director
    AAVFD
    IAFC
    www.holtvilleslapoutfd.org

  7. #27
    Forum Member Frmboybuck's Avatar
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    No, CDL is not THE answer but it is a start. Alot of guys have never driven anything bigger than a car. It would be a step in the right direction before throwing them in an apparatus and letting them drive.
    Buck
    Assistant Chief/EMT-B

  8. #28
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    I had a MN state trooper tell me that his interpretation is that a fireman can drive a truck to the scene without a CDL, but a CDL is required for the return trip.

  9. #29
    MembersZone Subscriber osh599's Avatar
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    Firefighter apparatus drivers in Michigan are exempt from having a CDL. Just like the DOT Inspection that most states do....not in Michigan.

    We are such a screwed up state with exemptions.
    Jim Shultz
    Oshtemo Fire Dept
    Fleet Maintenance Specialist

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