Thread: Mock Scenario

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    Default Mock Scenario

    Your engine is dispatched to a brush fire in a wash. Upon arrival, you see that the brush on fire is a 200 ft by 100 ft area, and appears to be spreading rapidly. There are homes 50 ft away from where the fire is. You begin to pull hose line, when dispatch comes in with another call for a house fire in your first due, with confirmed people trapped. The next due engine is 15+ minutes away, what do you do?
    Last edited by Eng18a; 01-15-2008 at 05:34 PM.

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    You were first called to the Brush Fire, that is the fire you should stick with, unless reassigned by a high ranking officer i.e. a Chief

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eng18a View Post
    Your engine is dispatched to a brush fire in a wash. Upon arrival, you see that the brush on fire is a 200 ft by 100 ft area, and appears to be spreading rapidly. There are homes 50 ft away from where the fire is. You begin to pull hose line, when dispatch comes in with another call for a house fire in your first due, with confirmed people trapped. The next due engine is 15+ minutes away, what do you do?
    Highly unlikely in this neck of the woods.

    However, if your lines are pulled you are committed.

    Who knows if the reported house fire w/trapped is for real... or even in your town. It's not confirmed until the FD is on scene.
    I am now a past chief and the views, opinions, and comments are mine and mine alone. I do not speak for any department or in any official capacity. Although, they would be smart to listen to me.

    "The last thing I want to do is hurt you. But it's still on the list."

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    However, if your lines are pulled you are committed.

    excelent response

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    Quote Originally Posted by ChiefKN View Post
    Highly unlikely in this neck of the woods.
    just one of thsoe what if's.

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    How does anything burn if its in the "wash"?
    RK
    cell #901-494-9437

    Management is making sure things are done right. Leadership is doing the right thing. The fire service needs alot more leaders and a lot less managers.

    "Everyone goes home" is the mantra for the pussification of the modern, American fire service.


    Comments made are my own. They do not represent the official position or opinion of the Fire Department or the City for which I am employed. In fact, they are normally exactly the opposite.

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    stay on the brush fire...then when you get back put your transfer in for the truck!!

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    My answer: do what's right.

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    I'd break the line, drop a can, a flap and leave one FF with his radio and tell him to do what he could to protect the houses. Then I'd respond to the fire with the trapped victims.

    Once things had settled down a little, I'd pay a special visit to each one of the local Commissioners and punch each of them square in the mouth for having such damn crappy fire coverage!
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    Quote Originally Posted by fireman4949 View Post
    I'd break the line, drop a can, a flap and leave one FF with his radio and tell him to do what he could to protect the houses. Then I'd respond to the fire with the trapped victims.
    Yeah, cause you know, brush fires aren't dangerous...and if it "goes south" you can always outrun them.

    I can't believe an officer would advocate leaving a guy by himself in that situation.

    If you want to break your lines and go to the structure, fine. But keep your crew intact.
    My opinions might coincide with someone of importance's POV... I wouldn't know, since I never bothered to ask. My policy is: "Don't ask, don't care."

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    That's a tough one. If you pull up to 200X100 area burning and spreading rapidly, especailly with houses near by, I'd hope you'd have more than 1 engine on the way. Mutual Aid would need to be dispatched for that irregardless of whether you have an additional house fire or not. I don't know how well 1 engine will take on a brush fire like that and save the houses. But that's just my opinion.

    I personally take life > property. That's just my take on firefighting. If there's confirmed people trapped, that's where I'd be heading. You can replace a few houses, but not a life. If we had some lines pulled (as long as all our cross lays weren't out) I'd break them, drop, and haul out to the structure fire. Then have the mutual aid split up to help assist at the house fire, and tackle the brush fire.

    However, if we've been committed to the brush fire for a while, all our lines were out, then we'd have to stick there. But with something like that, I'd hope there'd be a company on stand-by at your station waiting for "the big one" to come. If not, you might want to take a peek at your mutual aid/stand by SOP/SOG and maybe rework it a tad.

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    Quote Originally Posted by the1141man View Post
    Yeah, cause you know, brush fires aren't dangerous...and if it "goes south" you can always outrun them.

    I can't believe an officer would advocate leaving a guy by himself in that situation.

    If you want to break your lines and go to the structure, fine. But keep your crew intact.
    I guess that my sarcasm did no come through very well on the screen. I thought the little rolley-eye emoticon was doing his job...Apparently he's not.

    We would remain where we were until THAT scene was secure. One emergency at a time. Now if we made quick work of the brush fire, which I'm sure we would, a 100'X200' area is very small. I'd leave the hose where it lay and we'd be off to the other call.

    I can't count the times that we have been on "confirmed entrapment" calls, only to find that all were out prior to our arrival. This is not always the case though, so don't take this as an "LA-we don't search it" argument. We search everything! But in this scenario I would not leave houses to burn (which may in fact be occupied) when we're already there and can prevent it.
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    once we get some more responses, ill post what you should do... and its pretty easy too.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eng18a View Post
    once we get some more responses, ill post what you should do... and its pretty easy too.

    Hmmmmm......easy......

    Call for air support to do a drop on the brush fire while you go to the entrapment?

    Was that easy enough?

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    Quote Originally Posted by mfdbenji View Post
    You were first called to the Brush Fire, that is the fire you should stick with, unless reassigned by a high ranking officer i.e. a Chief
    So easy a caveman could do it.
    Drew Lyman,
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    I would stick to the scene I am committed to, mainly because those houses you are protecting may not be evacuated in time if something bad were to happen... ie: a big ol gust o wind....

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    ONLY IF IT WAS A CONFIRMED WORKING FIRE WITH ENTRAPMENT, NO SPECULATION WHAT SO EVER!

    I would break down the line, and make sure everyone is out of the structures in the path. Then head over to the worker, hopefully in time to get the person out. and as bad as this sounds, if this would to happen it would make a great case for more fire department funding.
    Last edited by ATFDFF; 01-16-2008 at 06:12 PM. Reason: forgot 2 sentences

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    While everyones answer was good, here is what the right one is... Stay at the brush fire...why?
    Quote Originally Posted by Eng18a View Post
    The next due engine is 15+ minutes away
    I just stated the next due engine is 15+ minutes away, but never said anything about a ladder truck, or rescue unit, etc being closer. The primary focus of the engine in this case would be to save lives and property from the spreading brush fire.

    The point of this was to get everyone to think beyond the text, and do some READING COMPREHENSION

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eng18a View Post
    While everyones answer was good, here is what the right one is... Stay at the brush fire...why?


    I just stated the next due engine is 15+ minutes away, but never said anything about a ladder truck, or rescue unit, etc being closer. The primary focus of the engine in this case would be to save lives and property from the spreading brush fire.

    The point of this was to get everyone to think beyond the text, and do some READING COMPREHENSION
    Ummmm, I hate to sound like an ***...BUT, if I am running this scenario as if this were my volly FD I would be waiting 15 plus minutes for a ladder since we don't have one and roughly 10 minutes for a rescue since we run a rescue pumper. I think your premise that people would automatically assume a ladder or rescue would hit the entrapment takes a lot for granted.

    In this scenario in my volly FD's area the brush buggy and tanker would stay with the brush fire and the engine would respond to the house fire / entrapment.

    Not enough info given by you to expect anyone to come up with your perfect answer.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eng18a View Post
    While everyones answer was good, here is what the right one is... Stay at the brush fire...why?


    I just stated the next due engine is 15+ minutes away, but never said anything about a ladder truck, or rescue unit, etc being closer. The primary focus of the engine in this case would be to save lives and property from the spreading brush fire.

    The point of this was to get everyone to think beyond the text, and do some READING COMPREHENSION
    Thanks for wasting my time.
    I am now a past chief and the views, opinions, and comments are mine and mine alone. I do not speak for any department or in any official capacity. Although, they would be smart to listen to me.

    "The last thing I want to do is hurt you. But it's still on the list."

    "When tempted to fight fire with fire, remember that the Fire Department usually uses water."

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    Quote Originally Posted by ChiefKN View Post
    Thanks for wasting my time.
    Make that "Our time"!
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    Serves you right for answering some explorer's question.

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    I have been taught that any brush fire over 100' X 100' is an immediate call for DNR. And in my exerience, once they get there we don't really do much. So...

    I would call for DNR and if they were available break my lines and head to the structure fire. Life over Property and day. Plus, I would definitely lose my job or be put on some type of probation if I had the chance to do a legit rescue.

    But I hope to God that the next engine would not be 15 out.

    On second thought... I would Nextel the on duty BC.

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    Ok, a little on the gay side, but ok.


    To continue this on a productive note...

    What if the next due apparatus (any piece of fire equipment) was 15 minutes away?

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    Quote Originally Posted by johnny46 View Post
    Serves you right for answering some explorer's question.
    HEY! I can have good questions sometimes!



    Can't I??????




    And yeah, to the OP, sorry that no one came up with your perfect answer because we all dont live in your area and know how things work.

    I just stated the next due engine is 15+ minutes away, but never said anything about a ladder truck, or rescue unit, etc being closer. The primary focus of the engine in this case would be to save lives and property from the spreading brush fire.

    The point of this was to get everyone to think beyond the text, and do some READING COMPREHENSION
    PUH-LEEZ!

    Wow, you are the fire god, you duped us all.
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