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  1. #1
    Forum Member wcfpd2601's Avatar
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    Default OSFM changing FFII & FFIII

    I have been hearing rumors that the Illinois State Fire Marshals Office is changing the FFII & FFIII programs to Basic and Advanced Firefighter. So I called OSFM Division of Personnel and Standards and they did in fact say it was true. Of course, at the time they didn't know when the switch would happen. Has anybody heard anything about a time frame? I know a lot of IFSI people and am hoping to ask them to see if they may know, but figured I would throw it on here to see. Thanks for any info.

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    MembersZone Subscriber WaterbryVTfire's Avatar
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    Do you know off hand the number of hours each is?
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  3. #3
    Forum Member wcfpd2601's Avatar
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    If I remember right the FFII program is like 280hrs. In IL firefighter II is the entry level certification. Don't remember the hours for FF III but it should be a little shorter.
    The success of a fire department depends on the willingness of its members to put aside their differences and work for the benefit of the dept/community.

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    Forum Member kprsn1's Avatar
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    Here is a post that I saved from last year made by Jaybird, I believe, regarding the changes. We have 2 in FFII class at Trenton being taught through SWIC and they are already following the new guidelines.

    Chad

    I am reading in the Spring/Summer issue of the newsletter for the Illinois Society of Fire Service Instructors that the OSFM is proposing changes to the FFII and FFIII certifications. My understanding of these changes is to bring the state more in line with NFPA standards and the rest of the country. The new Firefighter II will become a Basic Firefighter and the new FFIII will become an Advanced Firefighter. The Basic Firefighter certification will consist of the following:

    1. Member of an IL fire department.
    2. Completion of all Basic Firefighter cognitive objectives (classroom)
    3. Completion of all Basic Firefighter psychomotor objectives (practicals)
    4. Completion of a new "Module D," which will consist of the following:

    . 4a. Certification at the level of Hazardous Materials Awareness
    . 4b. Certification at the level of Technical Rescue Awareness
    . 4c. Completion of the classroom portion of Fire Service Vehicle Operator
    . 4d. Completion of IS-100 and IS-700 (ICS and NIMS)
    . 4e. Completion of basic CPR, and a basic first-aid course.

    There are not too many changes here, except the addition of FSVO and ICS/NIMS. FSVO is an eight-hour class, and not too bad, and ICS/NIMS are required for any department that wants federal money. I'm not sure what they mean by a "basic first-aid course," as there is already about three-four hours of first-aid/first responder type instruction in Mod B now.

    The real trouble I'm having is with the proposed changes to FFIII. The Advanced Firefighter will require the following:

    1. Certification as a Basic Firefighter for 3 years.
    2. Completion of all Advanced Firefighter cognitive objectives
    3. Completion of all Advanced Firefighter psychomotor objectives
    4. Completion of "Module D," which will be:

    . 4a. Certification at the level of Haz Mat Operations
    . 4b. Certification at the level of Vehicle Machinery Operations
    . 4c. Certification at the level of Fire Service Vehicle Operator
    . 4d. Certification at the level of Fire Apparatus Engineer
    . 4e. Technical Rescue Team Support Training


    Of the preceding, 4b through 4e are all new. I'm not sure what Technical Rescue Team Support Training is going to consist of. The committee was going to add additional classes in either Haz Mat, Tech Rescue or firefighting, but pared it down.

    Anyone already certified as a FFII or FFIII will have to complete the additional classes to convert their cert to a Basic Firefighter or Advanced Firefighter Cert.
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    Forum Member wcfpd2601's Avatar
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    Thanks!

    So the class your FF's are in...what are they gonna teach for the questionable first aid section? Do they have the course developed?

    Overall it doesn't look as bad as I expected. Although I don't really agree with the TRT support. The other certs in advanced are ok with me.

    I had originally heard that FFII's and III's certs would still be good/honored. I wish OSFM would just push out the info so everybody would know what the heck is going on...officially.
    The success of a fire department depends on the willingness of its members to put aside their differences and work for the benefit of the dept/community.

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    MembersZone Subscriber WaterbryVTfire's Avatar
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    By looking at the listing of requirements it looks like most of your level 2 is equal to Vermonts level 1 (IFSTA). And the level 2 is a bit higher than your 3.
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    Maybe the folks at OSFM will read this and get some more information out to us. It shouldn't be a problem for current FFIIs to "upgrade" to Basic Firefighters(?) these classes are already available and not demanding. We've got a guy taking the online class through IFSI - wonder if they're using the new curriculum?
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  8. #8
    Forum Member wcfpd2601's Avatar
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    I have a meeting coming up that Les (down state coordinator for IFSI) will be at, will see what he knows. Also have Management I coming up and will ask then too. Will keep ya posted. I think a few of us are going to try to squeeze a III class in before the changes. I was never worried about taking it, now I need it as a prereq for Fire Officer I. Then when it changes I will only be missing FAE and what ever the TRT support is for "Advanced."
    The success of a fire department depends on the willingness of its members to put aside their differences and work for the benefit of the dept/community.

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    We had an SFM audit this week and he left us a copy of the new reg's, only the 2nd one handed out. I do not have it in front of me but Jay's post seems to be spot on. The only other thing I can remenber is once it starts you'll have an 18 month overlap of both standerds before the new ones take affect. My guess is some classes are not designed yet.

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    Forum Member kprsn1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wcfpd2601 View Post
    Thanks!

    So the class your FF's are in...what are they gonna teach for the questionable first aid section? Do they have the course developed?
    wcfpd2601, I'll ask but our 2 guys are EMT's already so it doesn't affect them. One of the guys said that the class is also supposed to cover the FFIII curriculum. I'll see if I can get an objectives list.

    Chad
    SFPD Member MABAS Division 47
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    There is now a download at the OSFM web, on the PSandE page.

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    Quote Originally Posted by trainer View Post
    There is now a download at the OSFM web, on the PSandE page.
    Trainer, I looked for the link there but maybe I didn't recognize it. Can you paste it in here?
    Jack Boczek, Chief
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    Sorry guy's

    I seen the link and just assumed it was the paperwork that our auditor gave us, it was not. It was just some updated manual for the current ffII.

  14. #14
    Forum Member wcfpd2601's Avatar
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    Default Called OSFM about this topic today 12/08/08

    I called the State Fire Marshals Office today concerning the FFII, FFIII, Basic Firefighter and Advanced Firefighter classes and certifications. Here is what they said:

    (ME) Q. When will it switch to Basic/Advanced?
    (OSFM) A. Looking at July 1, 2009

    Q. What will be the new requirements/classes added?
    A. Still an ongoing process and not known at this time.

    Q. Will individuals have to convert their certificate from II/III to Basic/Advanced?
    A. No, can but do not have to (at least as far as the State is concerend).

    Q. How long will classes still be able to be taught using II or III rather than Basic/Advanced?
    A. Will have 3 years to complete classes.

    Q. Is the Essentials V book out and classes being taught using it and if so how long do we have to finish up classes using IV?
    A. To my (OSFM) knowledge Essentials V is not out or being used.

    Hopefully this clears things up for the time being.
    The success of a fire department depends on the willingness of its members to put aside their differences and work for the benefit of the dept/community.

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    Forum Member kprsn1's Avatar
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    wcfpd2601, at the rate they're going I'll be surprised if any changes hits the books by July. Was planning on starting a class the first of the year but I may hold off now until they figure out what is going on.
    SFPD Member MABAS Division 47
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    I have seen the Essentials V books for sale, so they are out there somewhere. Of coarse we know the state won't start using it untill the Essentials VI comes out, LOL!!!!!

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    OSFM has been talking about this for over 3 years. We'll see when it happens.

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    MembersZone Subscriber lilyogi's Avatar
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    I know for a fact Essentials V is being used as the Erie Fire Dept. is finishing up a FFII Class now and used this text. I really liked this text the best!
    Lilyogi

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by lilyogi View Post
    I know for a fact Essentials V is being used as the Erie Fire Dept. is finishing up a FFII Class now and used this text. I really liked this text the best!
    Do you know of anyone offering FFIII in the area? I am going to miss the class for EMT-P this next year and wouldn't mind catching some other classes.

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