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  1. #1
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    Question U.S. and European differences

    I need to get some differences between U.S. fire depts./firefighting and European dept's/firefighting for a class.

    Thanks in advance.
    Last edited by Firediver; 01-31-2008 at 02:15 PM.
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    Let's talk fire trucks!
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    The UK puts all of thier steering wheels on the wrong side.

    Seriously, the first things that come to mind are some of the differences in building construction; building access in the UK due to older, narrower streets; drastically different apparatus designs; the fact that in the UK, the FD brings thier fire hydrants with them; and a more defind command structure.

    This is just based on my limited reading and knowledge of the topic, I'm sure there are many others that can shed a lot more light on this....
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    g.p.m....l.p.m.

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    PSI vs. KPa

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    A lot of them speak different languages.

    They also wear those silly helmets!
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    Different style of fire apparatus. Looks wise. I dont know anything other than that. Also i have heard that they dont do vertical ventilation unless they have to.
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    A lot of them actually speak english properly.
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    They love their fog streams and while some departments do here, ask any big city guy and he will swear by his straight stream.













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    Interior vs Exterior attack.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cap6888 View Post
    A lot of them speak different languages.

    They also wear those silly helmets!
    But they have better looking vests.

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    Quote Originally Posted by len1582 View Post
    But they have better looking vests.
    What vests?

    I like our new ones.......



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    Quote Originally Posted by cap6888 View Post
    A lot of them speak different languages.

    They also wear those silly helmets!
    Those silly helmets have found their way to Ohio. I was watching the news a couple of weeks ago and saw a department perfoming overhual and I had to do a double take to make sure.....yep.....thats actually what I saw.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jonnyirons2 View Post
    Interior vs Exterior attack.
    That's not fair...I've been to the USA on a number of times and have seen plenty of interior Firefighting...

    Just like we've been doing for hundreds of years???


    Anyway,
    for a true view of Firefighting in the UK...which is pretty representative of the rest of the civilised world apart from the US/Canada, my article here explains fairly well and even in simple terms for those who might struggle with their understanding of anything that happens beyond the big ocean!!

    UK Firefighting
    Last edited by SteveDude; 02-01-2008 at 04:29 AM.
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    A few photos...





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    the firetrucks are different from the american trucks.the fire tactics also.

    site of the french brigade of Paris:

    http://www.pompiersparis.fr/bur_serv...p106/index.htm

    site of a friend of mine with different gears,the guys and gals can wear:

    http://pompiers-saintsymphoriensurco...d=46&Itemid=39
    "sauver ou périr"

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    2 french mottoes in french fire service.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Firediver View Post
    I need to get some differences between U.S. fire depts./firefighting and European dept's/firefighting for a class.

    Thanks in advance.
    you can also write in your report that RIT/RIC,Fast teams,do not exist in the french fire service.
    "sauver ou périr"

    "courage et dévouement"

    2 french mottoes in french fire service.

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    Thanks for the link Steve - very interesting article. Even if I did have translate back from yank-speak a few times...

    I was asked once on a forum if firefighting in Australia was along the North American or European lines. Definitely along Brit lines (I've been told numerous times that our methods were all taken from the Manual of Firemanship in the beginning. At least I think that's the name of it?). Very much multi-discipline, no such thing as truck, engine, squad or whatever crews. Some States have retained firefighters, but here in Vic we only have career and volunteer (no pay for us at all, so they never mind having us work overtime...).

    I know the original question only mentioned the USA and Europe - but I have to jump up and wave the flag so that we don't get totally forgotten! Anyway Firediver, I think Steve has provided you with what you need!
    Last edited by volfirie; 02-01-2008 at 09:28 AM.

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    Another difference between US and Euro firefighting is preconnected attack lines. Most Euro fire apparatus have a booster line as the only preconnect on the rig. They stretch rolls of hose as needed, while in the US and Canada we use preconnected hose lines.
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    After speaking to some UK guys their work rules are very specific. How often and how much you can work. What kind of work you can do and for how long. Maximum loading and lifting requirements.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SteveDude View Post
    A few photos...





    Nice pics - How did you photoshop the trucks in?




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    I think Mork had the OV in one of those pics!

    LOL

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    Quote Originally Posted by Firediver View Post
    I need to get some differences between U.S. fire depts./firefighting and European dept's/firefighting for a class.

    Thanks in advance.
    diver, Paul Grimwood, firetactics.com has a new book called Euro Firefighting.

    This book is for the CFBT (Flashover) Instructor, Firefighter, Company Officer and Fire Chief. The concept of teaching about 'flashover' using ISO steel shipping containers was developed in Europe - now read how European Instructors teach fire behavior using a vast array of Fire Development Simulators (FDS).

    This book will also take you out onto the fire-grounds of London, New York, Madrid, Chicago, Paris, Germany, and Sweden. It will demonstrate how similar fires are fought using different strategic approaches and shows how US and EURO fire-fighting tactics are gradually aligning in many areas. From Tactical ventilation, to Air Management (BA Control), to Rapid Intervention Teams, to high-rise firefighting, to Limited staffing (3-person crew ops); the author brings you the best tactics from Europe & the USA in one training manual!
    I haven't read it but sounds like it might help a bit.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Geinandputitout View Post
    After speaking to some UK guys their work rules are very specific. How often and how much you can work. What kind of work you can do and for how long. Maximum loading and lifting requirements.
    Hi mate,
    That's not quite true as it reads. Yes, becuase of H&S rules and a very effective union we have managed to reduce the working week from 96 hours in the old days down through 60 odd hours to 56 in the early 70's and 48 since 1978.

    There are strict rules about time off after day and night shifts...as in you can't be rostered to roll right onto another shift and do a 24 (For ranks up to and including Station officer (Capt) i.e the front line crews on the trucks. Thi salso precludes people from workinga side job after days/nights... although obviously they can't check what you are doing once you have left work.

    There are rules where you are restricted from work where it is pre-arranged...i.e a relief at a big job will have to have crews revolved every 3-4 hours. But in all honesty how could we as a very urbanised Nation run an effective Fire Service with time limits? A lot of the UK is covered by wholetime Stations because of the work rate in the urban areas... these guys are responding from Stations that go out around 2000 times each year (as a very ball park average) but many Stations in the large Cities like London, Manchester, Birmingham have Stations that go out well in excess of 3000 times per year. we wouldn't function if that were restricted.

    My last Station when I was on shift back in 2002 had a annual call rate of around 4700, it was rare for us to go uninterupted through the night and 10 pluss call shifts were regular. The reactive 999 work is just that...whether you get one call per day or 20...that is the way it is and wecan't just stop after 5 calls.

    As far as lifting/loading requirements... we, along with all UK employers/employees are bound by the 1974 Health & Safety at Work act and the Union not our bosses are the ones who fought long and hard to keep us as true to the rules of that act as possible.

    We have to abide by a whole host of H&S legilslation... Power Tool regs, Lifting regs, PPE regs, Working at height regs..etc...etc... So that means things such as ground ladders have to have a sticker on them saying 'Four Man lift' Power tools have to say 'wear protective equipment' and we are required to train and be examined as competent on any pieve of equipment.

    What we are doing is complying with the law and to do that we have to train our people, issue them with correct PPE, label equipment, make sure it is tested and safe... all of which may seem very OTT to the much less formal US Fire Service, but it works here in the UK, even though we are busy, because it has to work because it is the law... and it keeps Line of duty deaths and injuries down.

    I hope that puts a little more meat on the bones of what my colleagues told you.
    Steve Dude
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    Quote Originally Posted by volfirie View Post
    Thanks for the link Steve - very interesting article. Even if I did have translate back from yank-speak a few times...

    I was asked once on a forum if firefighting in Australia was along the North American or European lines. Definitely along Brit lines (I've been told numerous times that our methods were all taken from the Manual of Firemanship in the beginning. At least I think that's the name of it?). Very much multi-discipline, no such thing as truck, engine, squad or whatever crews. Some States have retained firefighters, but here in Vic we only have career and volunteer (no pay for us at all, so they never mind having us work overtime...).

    I know the original question only mentioned the USA and Europe - but I have to jump up and wave the flag so that we don't get totally forgotten! Anyway Firediver, I think Steve has provided you with what you need!
    Absolutely mate,
    Lots of simlarities and when I say UK European I always include all of our friends down the bottom


    Quote Originally Posted by ChicagoFf
    Nice pics - How did you photoshop the trucks in?
    Quote Originally Posted by jonnyirons2
    I think Mork had the OV in one of those pics!
    What are you gonna do with these Guys!!!! My Balls are held in clamps here they are breaking them so well.
    Steve Dude
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    Talking

    Big Difference.......can you find any overweight FF's in those pics of the Brits and Frenchies.....hmmmmm

    They might be onto somethink here

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