1. #1
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    Default can someone explain ISO ratings and what they suggest?

    What is an ISO rating? Can someone explain in detail?

    What does it mean if you have an ISO rating of 1....vs 10?

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    "When I was young, my ambition was to be one of the people who made a difference in this world. My hope is to leave the world a little better for my having been there."
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    thank you very much. also...where can i go to find out what the ISO rating is for a certain city? I am trying to find the ISO rating for Fort Worth, TX.

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    Class 2... Info from Fort Worth FD website under Facts...

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    An ISO rating tells you very little about a fire department. For instance, the Charleston Fire Department was a "Class 1" fire department the day of their tragic fire.

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    It's a rating of the protection provided to the community (supposedly). It's not a rating of the quality of the department by any other standard.

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    Quote Originally Posted by FlyingRon View Post
    It's a rating of the protection provided to the community (supposedly). It's not a rating of the quality of the department by any other standard.
    You, my friend, hit the nail on the head; drove it through the wood; and into ISO's foot.
    I believe them bones are me. Some say we are born into the grave. I feel so alone, gonna end up a big ol' pile a them bones

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    Quote Originally Posted by xstalkrx View Post
    where can i go to find out what the ISO rating is for a certain city?
    Anyone know if there is a listing of these?

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    Default ISO Game

    As a ISO Consultant in my down time I can tell you it is all a paperwork game, in fact in a interview with if I recall correctly firehouse last year(either the Jan. or Feb. issue) a senior manager with the private for profit monoply company called ISO it was "roughly" quoted you can take a big nice FD with all kinds of money and equipment but is only so so at doing the record keeping and then a small money strapped FD with little equipment but is great at record keeping and guess who is going to have the better ISO rating?

    ISO wants to see lots of paperwork not how you fight fires in the real world other than your ability to move water and thats not always a sure thing.

    Thats the reason more insurance companies or looking at going the way State Farm did on fire loss stats than using the ISO ratings as a major factor in setting policy rates.

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    Thanks for the info, thats some good stuff on the first link
    now I understand why our chief officers put so much time into those things and not enough into other things

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    Another way to explain it. A community with a rating of 7 might cost a homeower in that community 500.00 a year for his insurance. In another community with an ISO rating of 5, that same homwowner might pay 350.00 a year.

    This is a good tool to use when youa re going after funding. If you can show the community what they get when they invest more into their Fire Department and their infrastructure somtimes you can get more money out of them.

    Its all about the wet stuff to the hot stuff.

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    ISO was dreamed up for various industries so that people could make money creating rules, and consulting. It survives mostly on a diet of pencil-whipping and lawyer farts.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ffmediccfi View Post
    ...

    Thats the reason more insurance companies or looking at going the way State Farm did on fire loss stats than using the ISO ratings as a major factor in setting policy rates.
    State Farm was several years ago. Name the other insurance companies.

    By far the biggest benefit is to business (who have the most exposure to fire risk and who pay most of the tax $ for our BRT).


    See also www.isoslayer.com

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    Quote Originally Posted by ffmediccfi View Post
    Thats the reason more insurance companies or looking at going the way State Farm did on fire loss stats than using the ISO ratings as a major factor in setting policy rates.
    I'm not sure fire loss stats are consistently a good indicator of effective firefighting either. They can be skewed greatly by the type of structures you fight fire in...however, it means a LOT to an insurance company.

    It is my understanding that State Farm looks at total loss per zip code to establish rates...and by "total loss" it includes everything from theft to storm damage to fire loss...and not any one thing individually.

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    Default Follow up

    If needed let me have a cpl of days and I can try to find the web site I got this from a little over a year ago.
    Not saying I agree with ISOs game nor State Farms. Just stating what is out there.

    Most of these I have never heard of but as you can see there are a cpl of National companies on the list.

    The following Insurance Companies are seriously looking at following State Farm Insurance Companies in the use of Fire Loss Data (FLD) to determine there policy rates. With 60% of the USA fire departments being a Class 7 or worse that means all those zip codes covered be these companies would pay the highest rates if ISO is continued to be used. So these companies are looking to reform there policy rates via this new FLD system at the end of their current contract with the ISO and thus for remain competitive in terms of insurance policy rates.


    Allstate Insurance
    Allstate Texas Lloyds
    American Fire and Casualty
    American National Insurance
    Armed Forces Insurance Exchange
    Chubb Lloyds Insurance of Texas
    Colonial Insurance
    Consolidated Insurance
    CU Lloyds
    Delta Insurance Company of Texas
    Farmers Insurance Exchange
    Fire Insurance Exchange Company
    Hartford Insurance Company
    Nationwide
    Ohio Casualty Insurance Group
    Safeco Insurance Company
    Security National Insurance Company
    Texas Farm Bureau Underwriters
    Travelers Insurance Company

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    ISO really does not attempt to measure effective firefighting. And they really don't care what type of records you keep. As an agent for the insurance industry as a whole, they try to measure risk of loss.

    How much risk does your home have of being damaged or destroyed compared to mine? If yours has a wood shingle roof compared to my concrete tile, my risk is less than yours. Simple stuff really.

    One of the measures of risk is the level and adequacy of the local fire protection. That's where they try to evaluate the differences between a poorly equipped and poorly managed dept., and one with all the equipment, training and leadership to do a good job when the stuff hits the fan. In general their ratings serve a benchmarks to compare one dept to another. Like any rating in any real world situation, there are hairs being split and screams of outrage when Inspector A makes a decision one way and Inspector B makes the same decision another way. People are people.

    The insurance industry as a whole uses ISO ratings to measure risk. They also use prior loss history. They also use ZIP code analysis. They also use individual credit ratings. That's right, if I have good credit history and you don't, and we live right next door to each other in identical houses, we may pay different rates! And it's perfectly justified because the insurance industry can show that over the last 50 years, poor credit risks had more insurance claims.

    ISO is not the devil and they really don't care about the fire service - except to the extent that it impacts their risk of loss. If anyone comes up with a better way of measuring the effectiveness of a fire dept. trademark the technique and sell it to ISO.
    Remember, it IS as bad as you think and they ARE out to get you!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim917 View Post
    ISO really does not attempt to measure effective firefighting. And they really don't care what type of records you keep. As an agent for the insurance industry as a whole, they try to measure risk of loss.

    How much risk does your home have of being damaged or destroyed compared to mine? If yours has a wood shingle roof compared to my concrete tile, my risk is less than yours. Simple stuff really.

    One of the measures of risk is the level and adequacy of the local fire protection. That's where they try to evaluate the differences between a poorly equipped and poorly managed dept., and one with all the equipment, training and leadership to do a good job when the stuff hits the fan. In general their ratings serve a benchmarks to compare one dept to another. Like any rating in any real world situation, there are hairs being split and screams of outrage when Inspector A makes a decision one way and Inspector B makes the same decision another way. People are people.

    The insurance industry as a whole uses ISO ratings to measure risk. They also use prior loss history. They also use ZIP code analysis. They also use individual credit ratings. That's right, if I have good credit history and you don't, and we live right next door to each other in identical houses, we may pay different rates! And it's perfectly justified because the insurance industry can show that over the last 50 years, poor credit risks had more insurance claims.

    ISO is not the devil and they really don't care about the fire service - except to the extent that it impacts their risk of loss. If anyone comes up with a better way of measuring the effectiveness of a fire dept. trademark the technique and sell it to ISO.

    Yes...what he said. Sounds about right to me.

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    ISO really does not attempt to measure effective firefighting. And they really don't care what type of records you keep.
    and yet, the majority of the FD's score is based on..........documentation.
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

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