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I have to agree with FHJ718's

I have to agree with FHJ718's comments about how fire departments operated in the 1800's, and that social values of the time dictated certain "proper" behaviors. The same social values have been modified over the years as our society's mores have changed. The fourth book in my Firehouse Family series of novels, DEMISE OF THE HORSE FAIRY (due to be published soon) deals with breaking the rules, as do the earlier novels, MEMORIES, THE QUARRY, and THE FARM FIRES. These novels are set in the 1930's, but they could be set in today's world. Some behaviors cannot be changed by rules because they are personal ideas of what an individual thinks is his or her "right" to believe in something and to act upon that belief. A Code of Ethics is a good basis for demanding moral behavior, but if that Code and a department's rules and regulations don't do the job, then the problem is most likely--and unfortunately--a matter for our courts.

As social values do change

As social values do change over time, what becomes the central basis of our Code of Ethics we want to develop? Since everyone has their own individual right to believe in developing their own morality, what it is the ultimate deciding factor?

If things really are not much different in our culture than before, and people will just be people, why are we even discussing the need for a Code of Ethics? Perhaps all the negative social consequences of an increasingly immoral society (which is affecting the fire service) are really not negative social consequences afterall. Perhaps it is just a matter of changing social mores that we need to accept and roll with.

These of course are philosophical thoughts, and are not personally directed.

The white paper on the dark

The white paper on the dark side of the fire service is well done and much needed by all of us and to be inforced.

I like the Idea of the code

I like the Idea of the code myself and would be anxious to read it myself.

sounds fun...

sounds fun...

I am anxious to read the Code

I am anxious to read the Code of Ethics, but am pretty sure it will not have the intended effect as long as we essentially consider "The Brotherhood" as nothing more than "protecting my bad-acting buddies." Our current desire to just-be-nice to everybody on the department erodes the strength it takes to cast off the bad actors early on. We are then caught in a downward spiral where nothing happens until the lid comes off.


It should not be surprising that the slow degradation of our American culture over the past 40 years is felt in our departments. Selfishness and an over-abundance of addictive and sensual distractions permeate the lives of some of our members. The loss of our religious and moral national heritage has resulted in a cultural free-for-all wherein we are not allowed to judge others. A Code of Ethics will not change this much, but it might give us a central point of agreement upon what we will tolerate in The Brotherhood. But then we must be willing to act upon it. When you lie, cheat, steal, discriminate, harass, take drugs, and fornicate with your Brother's spouse, we should take your badge. This is not a job, it's a profession of honor to be treated as such.

 Although it sounds good, the

 Although it sounds good, the reality is that those alledged great and moral times some of us pine for were nothing but window dressing. Since the beginning of this country and the start of fire departments some people have always had questionable "morals" so saying that this is something new is just denial of reality. Look up the history of firemen, especially the 1800s, when they were nothing more than organized ruffians who brawled, extorted, terrorized "others" and committed crimes for politicians.

After seeing the Gangs of New York and the scenes where the firemen were creating havoc, I decided to look up as much as I could about the firemen in the 1800s, and in particular those on the East Coast. Some surprising stuff can be found. The argument could be made that they were nothing more than gangs with helmets. 

 I  was once shown old orders and charges(late 1880s), where firemen were suspended and/or fired for; public drunkedness, fighting in quarters, not coming back after dinner break, failure to tend to the horses and numerous other offenses. 

There's reality and there's the fallacy. I think some people have preached how monk like we are so much that they actually believe it. Firemen are human and are a reflection of society.

In light of the facts you

In light of the facts you speak of, there is a difference today you have confirmed by noting that "fireman were suspended and/or fired for..." a bunch of things it is very difficult to do the same for now. The larger point of the post is that we tolerate way too much and then wonder why the wheels fall off. Thanks for showing that comparison.

 You missed my point. We are

 You missed my point. We are a reflection of society. We already have a "Code of Ethics" it's called the rules & regulations of your particular department. If somebody violates them, then deal with it. 

My comments on firemen of the past was to show how this image of "those" bygone days of idyllic times was far from the truth. 

There are members who have had problems and there will be others who will have future problems. You can't predict how things are going to work out. 

 

tmosher....where are you

tmosher....where are you from? where im from firefighters are human. just like the people they serve.

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